So You Want Pyrolox or Filox to Remove Iron or Sulfur?

So You Want Pyrolox or Filox to Remove Iron or Sulfur?
By Mark Timmons
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So You Want Pyrolox or Filox to Remove Iron or Sulfur?

You might want to re-think that. Maybe you have heard good things about Filox or Pyrolox or for that matter, Oxylox, Adox, Katalox, Birm or Greensand Plus, and  you are thinking about using one of these systems for your water problems.  I would strongly advise you to think again. The side effects are bad and the systems  don't work that well.  There are simply better ways to remove iron and sulfur from your water. Look, we used to sell those products, but they are old technology.  As I mentioned, there are much better ways to remove Iron, Sulfur and Manganese than Filox, Pyrolox or any of these manganese dioxide-based medias.  They have different names and different amounts of manganese dioxide, but they are essentially the same.  You probably wouldn't be happy if a horse and buggy were your chief mode of transportation and you won't be happy with Pyrolox or Filox in all likelihood. If you want to remove iron, manganese or sulfur from the water, in most cases, it must be oxidized.  Oxidation can be accomplished by several methods, including oxidation with a manganese dioxide based media, if (BIG IF) the ORP (Oxidation Reduction Potential) and pH of the water falls in the appropriate range.  Watts, who sells a manganese dioxide based media under the name of Filox, says that their manganese dioxide media works from a pH of 5 to a pH of 9.  That is simply untrue.  There's no need to elaborate. Not only are Filox or Pyrolox or MOST of these manganese dioxide medias sensitive to pH and ORP, but they require massive amounts of water to backwash.  There are occasions when you may want to use a manganese dioxide based media, especially if you want to remove iron and/or manganese and you have no iron bacteria present.  Filox and Pyrolox weigh in at 114 pounds a cubic foot and require a lot of water to backwash. The other problem is that Filox and Pyrolox don't work well with iron-reducing or sulfur-reducing bacteria and when they is iron or sulfur in water, it is frequently accompanied by the iron or sulfur bacterias.  I suppose that there are a few applications where Filox and Pyrolox may work, but there are too many factors that limit and impair it's function.  In most home applications, I recommend one of four methods to remove iron:  (1) Air Injection with Catalytic Carbon;  (2) Hydrogen Peroxide with Catalytic Carbon; or (3) Ozone.   I will summarize the advantages of each: [caption id="attachment_1301" align="alignleft" width="63"] inFusion Air Injection Iron Filter[/caption] AIR INJECTION: This is a method that we started using nearly 20 years ago, but finally perfected recently.  The system that we sell is called the inFusion.  During the backwashing process, the infusion introduces a pocket of fresh air (which is enriched with oxygen) into the top of the tank. As the water passes through pocket, it is infused with the oxygen in the fresh air, and the special catalytic media is a catalyst between the iron and sulfur and the air. The oxidation process is almost instantaneous - the iron and sulfur precipitate out and are trapped by the media bed. Some dissolved oxygen is added to the water supply in the process.  The electronic control valve of the infusion filter automatically backwashes the system to clean the media and flush the precipitated iron and sulfur down the drain. Advantages:  Air Injection handles up to 8 PPM of Iron and Sulfur, does not require and chemicals and does not need as much backwashing (less water) than Filox or Pyrolox.  The cost of the system is low. Disadvantages:  If iron or sulfur bacteria is present, the Air Injection system will need should not be used. [caption id="attachment_2633" align="alignright" width="245"]Oxi-GEN OXI-GEN Hydrogen Peroxide System[/caption]  HYDROGEN PEROXIDE: We were one of the pioneers in the introduction of hydrogen peroxide as a viable technology in water treatment.  It successfully treats practically ANY level of iron or sulfur, but it is fed on a continual basis.  Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2) is composed of the elements of water.  We call our H2O2 system the OXi-GEN system. Advantages:  Complete elimination of iron and sulfur, regardless of the levels, without the use of dangerous chemicals.  You can always predict for a certainty that it will eliminate iron and sulfur and the rotten-egg odor, even if the water contains iron and sulfur reducing bacteria. It also has a relatively low cost - approximately double the cost of the Air Injection. Disadvantages:  A Hydrogen Peroxide System does not remove manganese as effectively, so if high manganese is an issue, you may need something else. The annual cost of hydrogen peroxide can be $200 to $300 per year (but you will have exceptionally good water).  That's the only disadvantage.   [caption id="attachment_1295" align="alignleft" width="186"] Ozone System[/caption] OZONE: Ozone is unquestionably the best oxidizer for iron and sulfur and practically any level of the contaminants can be eliminated.  Ozone Systems require custom-engineering for each application and must be properly sized to be effective. Advantages:  No chemicals and total iron and sulfur reduction.  Low maintenance.  No annual chemical cost.  This is simply the best-available-technology for iron and sulfur reduction. Disadvantages:  A considerable amount of space is required for the system and the cost is 3 to 4 times the cost of a hydrogen peroxide system.

Conclusion:

There simply is not one system that does it all!  A good water analysis will reveal which is the best way to treat your water.  Give us a call and we can help you figure it out.  
August 4, 2012
Comments
Alex Pfister
January 17, 2013 at 5:39 PM
We have sulfur odor, and filox has removed most of that, but we still have black stains in toilets, washing machine, showers, and dishwasher. What do we need to eliminate the black stains, which I assume are manganese?
mark
January 28, 2013 at 11:40 PM
Alex, Never assume. It likely is sulfur that is not fully precipitated. You need a good well water test before I can help. This is what you need: https://www.uswatersystems.com/us-water-lab-water-test.html
chuck turbak
February 2, 2013 at 2:05 PM
I have iron bacteria problem - all of the vendors that I have met on site want to install a water softner. I have a 300 gallon holding tank with a house pump set a 60 psi. I purchased a pre filter and carbon filter before the tank - the quickly clogged up - I then purchased what is called the iron rival with back wash with filox - which clogged up and then replaced with birm which causes my well pump to go into oveload mode. Any ideas?? I am in Washington
mark
February 6, 2013 at 11:42 AM
Chuck, I will need to know a little more about your water and what you are doing with it. Is there a pressure tank before the 300 gallons storage tank? Why do you have a 300 gallon storage tank? Do you have a good water analysis? What size line into the tank and out? How many in the family and number of bathrooms?
Johan
February 19, 2013 at 7:07 AM
<em>What media are you using in your filters for air injection and Oxi-Gen systems?</em> BR Johan <strong>The Water Doctor replied: We have found that in practically every application, catalytic carbon is the best. It is more expensive that Birm and others, but we have extraordinary results with catalytic carbon.</strong>
Ernesto
November 28, 2013 at 3:16 PM
Hello I have a problem, originally working with a filter FILOX and I reduced the level of Fe from 3.3 to 1, after a chlorine injection Fe level increased to 2.8 and I could not lower it back to What could be the cause? thanks Ernesto, I need more information. What is your pH? Do you have any iron or sulfur? What is your hardness level?
James
January 2, 2014 at 4:20 PM
I've been researching ways to get rid of the bad smell that comes from the water in my deep well, which is most noticable from the hot water spigots. In your blog article, "So You Want Pyrolox or Filox to Remove Iron of Sulfur?", the opening paragraph states, "Maybe you have heard good things about Filox or Pyrolox or for that matter, Oxylox, Adox, Catalox, Birm or Greensand Plus, and you are thinking about using one of these systems for your water problems. I would strongly advise you to think again. The side effects are bad and the systems don’t work that well." So, I'm taking your advice and "...think[ing] again..." about a solution to my water problem, and I would like to know what the bad side effects are that you mention in the blog article? I've only found one article after 3 days of internet searching which says Manganese Dioxide is hazardous (http://tagis.dep.wv.gov/tri/cheminfo/csfs81.txt), all other information tells me it is safe to use for filtration of iron, sulphur, and manganese from water. So, I'm a little confused by your statement regarding bad side effects and the other information I've been reading. Thanks for your help, James
Mark Timmons
January 5, 2014 at 9:20 AM
James, There are no physical or health side effects. The side effects that I am talking about are because the media is so dense, It is difficult to backwash and if you backwash it properly, you will have nearly 200 gallons of waste water, which will have a bad side effect on your septic tank. If you don't backwash it properly, it loads up with the sulfur, iron or manganese. Also, if your water has any sulfur reducing bacteria or iron reducing bacteria, it will plug and foul quickly. We have a new type of Manganese Dioxide media that we are presently testing, but at this moment, I would advise you to avoid it. Here's what we recommend, with NEVER a failure: https://www.uswatersystems.com/infusion-backwashing-filter-for-iron-sulfur-and-manganese-removal.html Before installing one, I recommend a full water test, which would be this one: https://www.uswatersystems.com/us-water-lab-water-test.html Once we know what is in the water, we can GUARANTEE we will fix it!
Bruce S
January 28, 2014 at 4:43 PM
Note that greensand and greensand plus, which you say work better than pure manganese dioxide, are both sand with manganese dioxide coatings... not sure where you are going with this. I have noticed that most manganese dioxide medias are used in conjunction with oxidants, in fact the use of them alone is not, as far as I know recommended by any manufacturer. In general the metal dioxides are known to act as catalysts, ie titanium dioxide in your auto catalytic converter. Manganese dioxide is just another in the periodic group. I am not in the industry, but I think your article is inflammatory at best. Would be interested to see if you publish my comment.
Mark Timmons
January 30, 2014 at 6:26 PM
Why wouldn't I publish it? Because you say it is inflammatory? It's a free country - you can say that water is composed of cottage cheese (doesn't make it so). There's nothing inflammatory about the truth. Most manganese dioxide media has critical problems and I spell it out based upon 42 years of experience - maybe if you had the same experience or had one of these filters in your home you would think differently. I didn't say to NEVER use them, I just say that they are problematic.
Mark N
March 29, 2014 at 1:25 AM
I'm currently stumped with my water situation. I have H2O2 injection (meter-driven), contact tank and catalytic carbon tank filter (Fleck 7000 head) followed by a dual density 1 micron dual density cartridge filter. My baseline water is roughly 6.8 - 7.0 pH, with IRB, iron around 2ppm and manganese around 0.180ppm. Hardness is around 70mg/L. The IRB and iron are completely neutralized: last lab test showed iron at 0.05ppm: I've had several tests done over MANY months (of tweaking) and the iron is either not detectable or extremely low. I cannot get rid of the manganese! Last lab test showed 0.143ppm, and I'd had (as measured with a Hatch test kit) a 2.0ppm H2O2 residual post-contact tank: I've tweaked it this high to try and force the issue- to no avail. If not for this manganese issue the water would be fantastic. All the research that I've done has suggested that the manganese should be managed by the system that I have. I've had my carbon filter backwashing every other day, but that didn't seem to make any difference. Backwash output doesn't go into the septic (goes to a ditch on my property), so no worries about the amount of water used (though, however, seems a bit excessive having 110 gallons used for backwash when I only use about 80 gallons per day). What are your thoughts?
Sean
April 15, 2014 at 12:19 AM
I am currently researching manganese filtration and would like some recommendations. Well with a flow rate of approximately 16gpm, servicing 2 homes and a barn as well as irrigation around each home. Well outlet is 1.5". Because this well services 2 houses, I would like to see as minimal pressure drop as possible from the manganese filter as water softener a are going to drop it even further. House 1: 1 full bath, 1 powder room (toilet sink only) House 2: 3 full bath Manganese: 0.507 mg/l pH: 7.7 Hardness: 530 TDS: 1000 Sulfate: 220 mg/l No sulfur smell in the water, but definitely manganese problems. Would like to have manganese filtration within the pump house, water softener at both houses, and point of use reverse osmosis to handle the Total Disolved Solids issues. I would like a system that is automated as possible, without breaking the bank, as this would need to be maintained by my mother; so chem free if possible, but not completely necessary. Thank you, Sean
Mark Timmons
April 15, 2014 at 3:13 PM
Sean, We can solve your problem. Give one of our Certified Water Specialists (none on commission) a call at 800-608-8972 and we can painlessly solve your problems.
Sean
April 15, 2014 at 3:54 PM
Thanks Mark. I have received an e-mail from you as well as Jacob. Hopefully we can come up with a reasonable solution that will fit my needs.
Dan Entingh
July 21, 2014 at 6:14 PM
I find it interesting that you discredit industry standard medias and then turn around and do not disclose the "special catalytic media" you are using in your systems. So much for disclosure. To say that these long standing medias do not work is a misrepresentation of the facts, they do work and work well.
Mark Timmons
July 21, 2014 at 7:55 PM
Dan, No where do I say these medias don't work. They just don't work as well as other methods and this is a blog that is ever-changing. What you are reading is 2 years old. We have a new manganese dioxide media called Katalox Light that weighs 66 pounds a cubic foot and is far superior to any of the above manganese dioxide based medias.
Dan Entingh
July 22, 2014 at 8:29 AM
The first paragraph "The side effects are bad and the systems don’t work that well." If your blog is ever changing, perhaps you could re-write this so that it is not mis-leading. Thanks.
Mark Timmons
August 2, 2014 at 8:48 AM
What is mis-leading about that? The side effects are wasted water, purple water, THM's in your water and they do not work that well in many cases. I stand by that statement!
wayne k
January 29, 2015 at 10:36 PM
you do not state the h2o2 strength or the size off the inlet on the system. these are important. I have one inch inlet and exit and can buy 3% h2o2 at walmart for 1.29 a quart. why is the cost 300 to 600 dollars a year. basicly i would like to know the injection rate. is there any problem clogging drain pipe on back flush?
Mark Timmons
February 2, 2015 at 3:58 PM
Wayne, We fixed the web page and added the strength of the H2O2 and the inlet size. Re-fresh your browser and it will show up. You can't use 3% from Wal-Mart - it must be 7%... and stabilized because it loses potency very rapidly. I am re-doing the blog post. It was older and some information is outdated. Refresh your browser and re-read it. WE cannot know the injection rate unless we know the oxidation demand. We were one of the pioneers into H2O2 technology over 20 years ago and we have no issues with it.
scott
August 10, 2015 at 10:26 PM
This guy is a complete idiot. As a 25 year water treatment veteran I have pulled out dozens of ozone oxidation systems. Using a maganese dioxide resin has a lot of parameters and you need more than a couple paragraphs to be able to learn them. in fact the only time I even use ozone anymore is in a bubbler storage tank. Using a maganese dioxide filter media weather gets anything from green sand plus to Magnavox Pro there are certain rules you must follow whether they are batch regeneration or continuous regeneration. Take what this article says at face value you cannot learn water treatment from reading an article that takes many years of training and learning in the field. there's literally hundreds of different technologies for water treatment something like Fand its wind vessel system with continuous regeneration done properly can remove 30 parts for opartof iron along with hydrogen sulfate for years and years if setup correctly with the right valve head right backwash rate and write chemical injection system. Just be careful what you guys read on the internet. There are problems that only maganese dioxide resin can still handle properly even if you have to use high amounts of chlorine in continuous regeneration in a twin vessel unit like a fleck 9000 valve backwashing 10 inch x 54 inch vessels at eight and a half gallons per minute.
Mark Timmons
August 12, 2015 at 10:27 PM
I debated whether I should post this since he called me a complete idiot, but I decided to go ahead and let you make up your own mind! I'm not even going to say anything in rebuttal. Some things speak for themselves!
William Saumier
August 14, 2015 at 1:35 AM
I have a yellow or gold type color water and wanted to know what you recommend. The water reports illustrate: Iron = 5400 ug/L Manganese = 290 ug/L Sulfate = 309 Bicarbonate = 266 Copper = 0.061 Zinc = 0.12 Tubidity = 9.9 NTU Color = 9.4 pH = 7.6 Which system do you recommend? Thank you, Bill Saumier
Mark Timmons
August 15, 2015 at 2:59 PM
I would need to see the results from this test before I could recommend anything: https://www.uswatersystems.com/us-water-lab-water-test.html
Michael
September 6, 2015 at 5:18 PM
Hi Mark: My questions surround the possible use of peracetic acid (PAA) as a resin bed sterilizer and as a potent oxidizer to remediate small amounts of clear water iron, sulfur, and iron/sulfur metabolizing bacteria. Currently I use citric acid and potassium chloride to clean and regenerate my resin bed. I suspect that the bacteria are also interacting with the water heater anode to produce more noticeable levels of hydrogen sulfide than those in the cold water lines. It's important to note that the sulfur odor is most noticeable in the cold water lines immediately prior to cleaning with citric acid and KCl. I have two questions. I have been unable to locate a "retail source" of PAA (e.g. Enviro Tech's Perasan® A). It seems to me that PAA would be an excellent oxidizer to pair with a catalytic carbon (e.g. Calgon-Carbon Centaur), or Watch Water Katalox Light). Cordially, Michael
Mark Timmons
September 17, 2015 at 8:32 PM
At this point, PAA is not really a viable option. When water that has hydrogen sulfide is heated, it de-gases. Hydrogen Peroxide is the best oxidizer with Cat Carb (we like Jacobi better than Calgon) and I do not recommend an oxidizer with Katalox. How much Hydrogen Sulfide do you have?
Michael
April 5, 2016 at 5:45 PM
Hi Mark: This is Michael (hydrogen sulfide problem - see your note 09.17.2016): I used the Hach (alka-seltzer test) at the well head, it showed less than 0.25 ppm H2S. This is in line with the nose test - "not really too bothersome." However, I replaced a very old conventional hotwater heater with a new AO Smith heater and now, after several months, the H2S is very objectionable from the hotwater side when using the shower. My assessment is that I have a bacteria problem (Fe and S metabolizing beasts that enjoy being warm) that I must kill. I have a reliable SFR 15 gal/min flow at the house, Have two baths, would like about 6 gal/min delivery. Additionally: ferrous Fe 0.5ppm, Mg is trace, the water is very hard and the carbonates contribute to the somewhat basic pH, most of the time the water is clear without any turbidity - perhaps once or twice a year the limestone below collapses and the water becomes turbid for a few days, then clears. I have a water to air heat pump that uses the same well/pump. Therefore I propose to use the flow sensor on the Clack control head (softner) to trigger a Steiner pump. The Steiner pump would feed diluted household bleach at a rate sufficient enough to be bactericidal (water temp about 71 F) with the SFR mentioned above. I have not calculated the free Cl and holding tank sizes yet. After the holding tank (unknown size at this point) I thought Katalox Light with chemsorb zeolite granules followed by the Catalytic Carbon (remove the Cl, turbidity, and other undesirables (we have measurable radon, and especially the various DBPs disinfection by products, [my neighbor has a lot of tannins, fortunately as of now I do not; though I am sure there are humic and fulvic acids. We are surrounded by swamp and wet prairies.] Finally, on to the softener..... I would need to disinfect the system (peracetic to disinfect the resin, instead of sodium hypochlorite to avoid decross-linking the resin); would use bleach to disinfect the distribution system, including the hotwater heater. I would pour one gallon of bleach down the well head. Hopefully, the newly invented system would provide clean, soft, odor-free potable water..... What do you think? How much would this cost? Cordially, Michael
Mark Timmons
April 27, 2016 at 8:56 PM
Michael, Sorry for the delay – I have been on vacation. Now for the answer – I would not even consider that. I have been treating water like this for a long time. There are too many reasons to articulate why this won’t work. Here’s what will work: https://www.uswatersystems.com/infusion-backwashing-filter-for-iron-sulfur-and-manganese-removal.html Why have two filters when one will do it all? Why use chlorine which produces some hazardous disinfection byproducts when H2O2 is a better oxidizer and is made of the elements of water?
Geoffrey
September 24, 2016 at 2:57 PM
Hi Mark, Thanks for all the insight. Interested in your take on our water problem. We recently had a well drilled for our house and have high iron. Here are some details: Hardness is 6 gpg or about 96 ppm. PH is 7.6 Iron is high at 1.6 ppm and it tastes a little metallic. No evidence yet of iron bacteria. No smells and no clumping. Manganese is zero TDS is 137 ppm I dont have a result for hydrogen sulfide but the water doesn't smell bad, just moderate metallic taste. Also, we have decided against a softener. We like the taste of hard water and are ok dealing with the level we have. So just interested in solving the iron issue. The company who drilled our well brought out a dealer from a national company who recommended an Impression Plus iron filter using Greensand Plus as the media. Any thoughts? I find it interesting that your blog is critical of manganese dioxide solutions, yet include Katalox Light which uses manganese dioxide as part of its solution. Thanks, Jeff
Mark Timmons
September 25, 2016 at 12:42 AM
We offer Katalox which is a manganese dioxide based media because it does have some applications where it works well. It is the best of the manganese dioxide based medias, but we are not fond of it. Just because we sell a product does not mean we endorse it. If it were my home, this is what I would use: https://www.uswatersystems.com/infusion-backwashing-filter-for-iron-sulfur-and-manganese-removal.html Katalox is about 10% Manganese Dioxide. Greensand Plus has a lot less manganese dioxide than that and it is 35% heavier which means it takes a huge amount of water to backwash.
Shawn Cross
February 26, 2017 at 11:21 AM
I respectfully disagree with you in using hydrogen peroxide as a water treatment option. After several years of applying H2O2 as an oxidizer for sulfur removal, I've discovered a few things. First off, how using peroxide does nothing to eliminate nuisance bacterias. If anything it makes it worse. I've had multiple filter beddings that had to be replaced prematurely because of nuisance bacteria's plugging up the bedding. A misconception about hydrogen peroxide is that you can overfeed it because it's just water with extra oxygen. But, hydrogen peroxide does more than just add extra oxygen to the water. This overfeeding can be highly aggressive towards metals, such as copper or brass, which can make it into the drinking water. This, in my estimation, is far more dangerous than the byproducts from injecting chlorine, which are easily removed, along with any chlorine residual, by a good quality carbon filter. Also, determining if you are under feeding or over feeding hydrogen peroxide is not possible without buying an expensive test kit. Chlorine residuals, on the other hand, are easily tested with a $5 pool chlorine test kit. And, as an added benefit, if there are nuisance bacterias in the water, chlorine will kill them. After a 10 year run of service calls and headaches , I have stopped offering HP sulfur removal systems. I've gone back to chlorine injection when nuisance bacterias are present, and when they aren't,, ORP filter medias, such as Katalox Light, have served me well. It's all in the application.
Mark Timmons
March 2, 2017 at 3:18 PM
Shawn, Please tell me how you used the H2O2: How and where it was injected, type of equipment, type of media used, how injection was initiated, etc.
Jan Provence
March 31, 2017 at 10:42 AM
Hi Mark We are a small Ontario Based treatment company and deal with lots of iron usually with great success. We use both hydrogen peroxide and ozone to successful treat for iron in our region and like you use Katalox when the customers water chenistry and pocket book indicate it will be a satisfactory solution. We typically have high iron low manganese and only occasional sulfur with little or no hardness to speak of. We do see iron bacteria very often. You have said in your article that "any level of iron" can be treated but I was wondering if you have ever treated over 20ppm we even have had a customer with 64ppm iron? We are struggling with this as while we have had success it has been trail an error and takes a long time during which the customer had to put up with poor quality water. In many cases we have seen new wells drilled with the same water so treatment is their only option. We would ask you to share your expertise please 1. What dose of peroxide ( we use 35% rather than the 28% that is becoming more typical in Canada) and length of retention do you use 2. With your ozone how big are the ozone generators in your system?
Mark Timmons
April 2, 2017 at 6:02 PM
We have taken out over 100 ppm of iron. In many cases, we start with ion-exchange and use a twin-alternating softener. I like to drop the pH to around 5.5 and then the softener will remove a substantial amount of it.... maybe all! Then, raise the pH and you are in business. By using ion-exchange you don't produce a lot of iron sludge. If you are using ANY retention with H2O2, you are doing it wrong. Please give us a call for more information.
Michael
August 7, 2017 at 9:49 PM
Hi Mark I have a Pyrolux filter system to remove the high iron content from my bore water supply it is in a holiday house and has had very little use but has been in place for the last 10 years most of the time not being used ( power has been shut down) as a result the filter material (Pyrolux) is very stained ( I have removed it from the tank and flushed it with clean water and it still keeps running brown) is there any way that I can clean this material ? Thanks in advance
Mark Timmons
August 8, 2017 at 7:31 AM
Nothing that would be helpful.
Chris Bommarito
January 30, 2018 at 8:59 PM
Mark, I have iron, iron bacteria and manganese. Ph: 6.7, Iron 6.94 Manganese:.36 TDS: 164 Hardness:8 Turbidity: 96.6 Flow rate 1 1/2" line=35gpm I have a green sand filter and it does not work. I was thinking of installing a 120 gallon retention/contact tank, a proportional injection system (chlorine) then a green sand filter, then a catalytic carbon filter. What if I want to go with hydrogen peroxide injection? What type of media filter is compatible? Green sand, Pyrolux? I'm open to suggestions.
Mark Timmons
January 30, 2018 at 10:40 PM
Here is all you need. No contact tank - just catalytic carbon: https://www.uswatersystems.com/infusion-backwashing-filter-for-iron-sulfur-and-manganese-removal.html
Scott Tomkins
February 2, 2018 at 9:43 PM
Hi folks, Just a little input on my experience. My water 14ppm Iron, 6 ppm manganeese, 5.4ph. First in tests I have done and put on you tube, I got sucked into hydrogen peroxide. First with HP it is VERY PH dependant. It dosent oxidize iron out unless the PH is 7.5, whereas chlorine does. Manganeese is NOT affected by H2O2. Chlorine does remove Manganeese. I did an experiment and I inject H2O2 and down the line inject chlorine and caustic soda. In my tests when used together produce a great instant oxidation ! Then contact tank which makes a huge difference folks! Then followed by greensand plus then centauer carbon. One thing I have found in 17 years of dealing with my awful water, is that there are no rules for iron removal.
Mark Timmons
February 10, 2018 at 12:20 PM
If you have sufficient hardness, with a pH of 5.4, I would use a twin-alternating water softener like our Synergy: https://www.uswatersystems.com/synergy-twin-alternating-metered-water-softener.html I'd follow that up with raising the pH. I would NEVER mix chlorine and H2O2! H2O2 is a much better oxidizer than chlorine and retention time for H2O2 just dilutes the process. You are right, that there are no rules, but the "cleanest" way to remove iron is by ion-exchange, if the pH is low.
Justin
April 6, 2018 at 5:59 PM
I have well water with 25ppm iron, 20grains of hardness, and 500ppm TDS servicing 3 bathrooms for 4 people. The water occasionally has a light sulfur smell, but the toilets do develop a dark grey scum relatively quickly. My biggest frustration are the iron stains in the showers, and as I am currently replacing the tile in the master bath, I DO NOT want to destroy the shower with rust stains after the work to replace it. The current system has a 20” cartridge filter with a 1 micron filter followed by a 25yr old 36k grain rain soft softener. The cartridge filter gets changed every quarter and is pretty gnarly with iron sediment. At the outlet of the pressure tank we get about 20gpm. My iron level isn’t so high, but I am conflicted on whether I need a full on iron filter or just a large water softener using the right iron removing resin. I am not crazy about the back wash water demand of Filox, and I don’t want the upkeep of chemical oxidizer. What do you recommend? Can the right softener handle this with a reasonable life span, or should I consider katalox light or catalytic carbon iron filter instead?
Mark Timmons
April 28, 2018 at 3:40 PM
If you think 25 ppm of iron is not high, then you might think 125 degrees F is not hot weather, but you would be wrong on both counts. We have treated much worse iron, but 25 ppm is extremely difficult. Neither Katalox light nor catalytic carbon is a good option for that amount of iron, in and of itself. Are you sure it is 25 ppm? I would suggest a detailed water test regardless: https://www.uswatersystems.com/us-water-lab-water-test.html
Mike Mitze
June 1, 2018 at 1:56 PM
I have an air injection type iron filter and may have iron bacteria in my system and the filter. I have chloringated the system in the past but have bypassed this filter assuming 200 ppm of chlorine is too much for this filter. Is there some way to chlorinate an air injection type filter. Thanks
Mark Timmons
June 2, 2018 at 10:27 AM
Use about 15 ppm of chlorine.
Loyal Davis
June 12, 2018 at 8:35 PM
Alkalinity 140/ Hardness 10gpg/ Iron 2.0/ Manganese 1.6/ Ph 6.8-7.0/ TDS 200/ Turbidity 9/ Backwash 8-9gpm I have had 2 systems installed by Culligan. Their media is "proprietary", not sure of the mix, but both systems needed constant maintenance and didn't do an effective job of clearing the iron and manganese. I removed it and installed a 13x54 vortec tank with 2.5CF of Katalox light behind an pressurized aeration tank. The water then feeds into a 500gal storage tank. This system is not removing the manganese. The softener, behind the storage tank, clogged up within 6 months and is useless. There was enough build up to block and burn up a grundfos ezboost pump, handfuls of goo that became cementitious on the intake screen. The next idea is to go to a filox media behind the aeration tank. Although my neighbor is having some success with a greensand/potassium permanganate. Also thinking the backwash may be too low and need to route the BW through the storage tank pump for more velocity than the 8gpm supplied by the well. There is so much misinformation and each person I speak with seems to contradict the person before. What are your thoughts?
Mark Timmons
June 12, 2018 at 9:30 PM
Thank you for your question. I will answer it privately by e-mail.
Joe
September 7, 2018 at 7:34 AM
Mr. Timmons: I read all the way through your presentation about Pyrolox and Filox systems. Except for one thing, the presentation is very convincing. However, it is full of grammar and usage errors. Your grammar and usage errors are the same as the grammar and usage errors made by scammers. Not only do scammers make errors using the written English language, but they can't speak the language correctly either. If the grammar and usage tell me that a presentation might be a scam, I abandon it and look for the truth as spoken or written by people who know how to use the English Language. (I bet you won't post this comment.)
Mark Timmons
September 7, 2018 at 10:59 AM
Well, Joe - You are wrong about that bet. I am not a journalist, but I am a Master Water Specialist. I try to use proper grammer as much as possible, but I am not a trained writer. I apologize for an grammatical errors, but if I were sick and went to a doctor, I would want a doctor who knew his craft better than anyone. His mastery of the English language would be secondary, as long as I could communicate with him. By the way, the best scammers know how to use the English language to their advanatage. If you judge everything in life by style instead of substance, you will be miserable and deceived! Good luck to you, Joe.
John Pousson
September 19, 2019 at 12:54 PM
I have a rusty decrepit 29 year old 80 gal steel air over water tank with a faulty air control valve. I am replacing it with a new epoxy lined or galvanized 80 gal tank, a new air control valve and a micronizer. A recent water test shows a pH of 7.74, Iron at 0.08 mg/L, and Manganese at 0.073 mg/L. I don't have a significant problem with iron stains, but I do have the black staining and clogging typical of Manganese. I also have rotten egg smell at fixtures that are used sparingly. What would be the most effective way of treating my water issues? My home has 3 baths.
Mark Timmons
September 28, 2019 at 11:28 AM
Well, I would like to know a little more about your water. There are several other ways to look at this. Please contact one of our Water Specialists for more information.